Advice for Strong Relationships from Jordan Peterson



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strange so what advice can you give to people who are looking to have a strong and meaningful and lasting relationship with someone well the first thing is to decide if that is really what you want is that no where do you think to say I don’t I don’t I want to be single forever do you think that’s realistic or fair assessment of oneself um I think that that’s for most people a pathway to insanity yeah you know the psychoanalysts used to think that and we all think this way in some ways that you’re saying because you’re well put together in your psyche is well structured right it’s internal somehow inside your head but and there’s some truth in that but here’s a here’s a more accurate viewpoint I think you outsource most of your sanity because it’s too complicated and so what you do is your parents raised you to be vaguely acceptable to other people and then you’re surrounded by other people your whole life and then every time you go off the rails a little bit even just a little bit people signal to you like you make a joke it’s not that funny and people don’t laugh and you think oh you know I should probably rethink my sense of humor a little bit or pay more attention or you tell a rambling story and you notice that everyone’s like lost in the distance okay so if you’re civilized enough so that people don’t shun you and you have people around you then they’re gonna be always telling you how to not be too insane well if you’re alone you drift you drift right you know and you’ll drift in the direction of your biggest weakness and so you know there are some people maybe they’re introverted and disagreeable they’re they’re not cut out for a lot of social contact but we’re social animals man right to the core and it’s a sub optimal solution for for the vast majority of people mm-hmm I think that people are having a harder time finding like let’s call them more permanent relationships is because it’s become increasingly easy to have fleeting casual sexual relationships I mean there’s a revolution right it’s a revolution in sexual behavior and it’s certainly not obvious that it’s a what is it a social thing is it just technology is this what people want to be doing because you think you think too easy yeah in some ways but it the technology has enabled this fleeting sexual oh definitely okay definitely and and that’s but we don’t want to underestimate how radical a technology that is especially especially for men I do feel that deep down that all these people men and women alike are always longing for something more meaningful well I think I think that that’s generally the case I mean you know part of the reason for a relationship is sexual contact obviously well that’s you you don’t necessarily need a relationship for that but that’s not the reason to to be with someone the reason to be some with someone when there’s a lot of them so one is well kids who have two parents do far better period the readout on that is crystal-clear it doesn’t mean that there aren’t many single parents who struggle to do a wonderful job that’s not the same thing it’s an average issue so you need plus it’s a lot of work to have kids you know you kind of need to divide up the labor especially in the first year or two you know cuz woman is completely overwhelmed in the first year and she needs somebody around to take care of her while she’s taking care of the kid fundamentally or at least that’s the way it looks to me so so there’s that you need the stable basis for children and takes them a long time to mature and they need to learn that relationships are trustworthy right so there’s utility and stability there but then also you kind of want to tangle your life together with someone you know because you have someone – well it’s like two ropes that are tangled together it’s stronger especially during times of weakness and you have two brains instead of one and that actually turns out to be really helpful when things are complicated and and it builds a solidity into your life and our Anna and a reality into your life to have someone who’s along with you on this very long voyage and so I think that deepens your life in a way that isn’t really possible with fragmentarily ship says a single person definitely and then there’s more to it than that it’s like I think of wrestling there’s this scene in the Old Testament where Jacob wrestles with an angel he’s wrestling with God actually which is quite an interesting that’s what Israel means right wrestling with God yeah that just blew me away when I learned it it so does that the true people are those who wrestle with God yeah it’s not believed exactly it’s a whole different thing man it’s a whole different thing and so like well it did from from from the work I did in the last couple of months looking at this and I looked into it quite deeply it does mean wrestling essentially and it does derive from that scene in the Old Testament where Jacob wrestles with God that’s when he gets the name Israel and his hip is dislocated right permanently he has a permanent limp after that it’s no joke but I think of marriage the same way like people think well they lived happily ever after it’s like that’s no way you want in a marriage you want someone to contend with you know because you learn through that wrestling you know like you learn where you’re an idiot and where you should stop being and and vice versa there’s a that’s the spiritual aspect of marriage it’s it’s the fact that you have to contend with someone under all sorts of circumstances theoretically is a what would you say it’s a it’s a manner of promoting psychological or you could say spiritual growth and it’s genuine you know that’s why marriage is a sacrament in most human communities right it’s it’s stamped both by the state and by the sacred authorities because it’s not just a physiological union that’s what animals do and I mean there’s nothing wrong with the physiological Union but it has to be placed in the context of everything else a human being is and I do think it’s dreadful for people not to have that and do you think it’s it’s become harder for people to have meaning full lasting relationships or has it always been desired I feel like I thank God that I’m not dating now because I feel like it must be its it seems like it’s miserable out there right now well yeah it’s a try to meet people it is hard for although what you don’t P it’s easier to meet people because there’s more ways of meeting them right but the ways of meeting them is are more shallow my in my clinical practice I would say that the rise of the internet dating option has actually overall been good for people who are looking for a partner now there is some speculation and some evidence that it lowers the transaction price of separation and divorce you know because one of the reasons you don’t separate or you don’t get divorced is like well you’re gonna find someone else and if it’s easier to find someone else then perhaps you’re more tempted to sever the relationship so maybe you lose in one place where you gain in the other but I think there are different kinds of hard that it is you know it’s hard for couples to figure out how to manage two careers it’s hard for women to figure out how to get educated and get their career launched at the same time that they’re finding a partner and having kids because women have this tight timeframe you know I mean they’ve got to get a lot done by the time they’re mid-30s for sure and so it’s compared it’s not much time you know it’s like 15 years really from the time you’re an adult that’s you better get at it it’s not very long right so I think there are new challenges that have arisen that weren’t there for previous generations but previous generations had it hard in other ways that’s so true yeah like to understand how to make a relationship work like it’s not just magically you need to kind of put in the work to make it work it’s hard compromise a lot of times on that if you live by yourself you can do everything the way you would want yeah if you live with someone else then there’s compromises to make yes in the long picture it’s better for you well that’s that’s it that’s it there’s sacrifices to be made in the short term you know and I mean people have to the effort issue is like well when you’re in love with someone you’re going to organize your schedule and make them a priority and you know that’s in some ways a fleeting state although it’s not necessarily as fleeting as people think it is but whatever it’s it’s obviously a priority then you get married and you know you kind of get accustomed to having each other around and then everything else is more important and the relationship drifts to the bottom and then people get dissatisfied and they start looking for excitement and adventure otherwise well you can’t do that you have to prioritize the relationship like my observation clinically has been for a couple to maintain their relationship without it deteriorating they have to spend ninety minutes a week together talking about their lives about how the house is run about what they’ve all been doing to keep their stories caught up right that’s not really even that much John it’s not it’s not that much yeah but but and which is a good thing you can’t actually do it and then they need to spend at least one time having a date and two is better one is necessary to is better you can’t aim for a lot more than that because you know life is very busy and yeah if it’s going to be sustainable it has to be realistic but they need to make time for each other twice a week and stand talk in like in a non romantic way just practically about the domestic economy and about everything that’s going on and that keeps people tied to each other and updated and so that’s sort of your minimal commitment level if you don’t want things to deteriorate